Berkley Center

Background: As part of the Education and Global Social Justice Project, in June 2012 undergraduate student Charlotte Markson interviewed Marcelo Coppetti, S.J., the vice president of student ministry at the Catholic University of Uruguay. In this interview Coppetti discusses the network of relationships between the university, Fe y Alegría Uruguay, and the Jesuit order; he also describes the unique place of Catholic education within Uruguay and the challenges created by a historically strong emphasis on secular education in the country.

Can you tell me about yourself and how you came to work at the Catholic University [of Uruguay]?

I am Uruguayan and was born here in Montevideo. As a child I attended the Jesuit school here, just as my father and brothers had done, so I have always had a strong connection to the Jesuit order. After graduating from high school I attended university and graduated with a degree in international relations. Afterwards, I joined the Jesuit order.

I have always been interested in politics and economics, so I was lucky to be able to complete three years of my theological education in Spain and later in France. In Spain I had a very good professor [who taught] social doctrine of the Church who showed me that I was able to link my previous studies with my theological studies in the Society of Jesus. So, I started focusing more on social and moral doctrine, and finally got my theological degree in economic and social ethics. This allowed me to enroll in a doctoral program at the Catholic University of Chile, which I am still working on now.

Here in the Catholic University I act as vice president of student ministry. This means I am in charge of student affairs in this area; I work on the focus of the education we offer, and everything that shapes our university’s identity and mission.

Can you tell me about the connection Jesuits have to education?

While the order did originate in an educational environment, the University of Paris, it was not originally an education-focused order. It started out as a missionary order in the time of the great discoveries. Nonetheless its founder, Ignatius of Loyola, was aware of the importance of good education and required all Jesuits to be poor and scholarly. Because of the excellent education Jesuits enjoyed, they started being hired as educators for the children of nobility and soon started founding schools and universities. Initially the order worked based on the idea that the nobility were those who had both the power and resources in order to effect change. Evidently with time education became more democratized and nowadays is considered something which also has to be accessible to the lower classes.

The Society of Jesus is firmly convinced that a real social transformation will only be achieved through education. Here in the university we speak of shaping students who are conscious, compassionate, committed, and competent. Competent in their education and professional training, conscious of the realities of their country, compassionate and committed to this reality, capable of being moved by this reality, and capable of committing to changing this reality. I think that is the spirit behind a Jesuit education.

Nowadays the Society of Jesus is putting a large emphasis on education for the disadvantaged, because education is a tool that can help overcome poverty. It is a very potent and powerful tool of transformation. The Jesuit order is committed to education in middle and higher classes, to public education in traditional schools and universities and to work in more disadvantaged groups such as the work Fe y Alegría and other networks are doing.

What is educación popular (popular education)?

There is no technical definition for popular education, but basically the term signifies education focused on the low-income population that does not have the option to access any education other than public education. Public education in those areas is oftentimes of low quality, because the most successful teachers can choose where they would like to work and obviously choose the more accommodating sectors. So, it is a self-reinforcing cycle.

Because of this there has been an effort by the Jesuit community to make Catholic education accessible in these areas. However, Uruguay is strongly marked by its secular tradition, and the government does not financially support Catholic education in any way. Since the students are unable to pay in order to cover the costs of running the schools, a great effort is made to find sponsors who are willing to support quality education with a Christian orientation in these poorer sectors of society.

Can you tell me about your work in Fe y Alegría?

I am connect with Fe y Alegría in two ways. On the one hand I am the representative of the provincial aspect, since Uruguay and Argentina form one Jesuit province and the provincial lives in Argentina. So, I am in charge of the link between Fe y Alegría and the Jesuit order and other institutions, such as the Ministry of Education and Culture and the many businesses that support us. I also support the director of Fe y Alegría, Martin Haretche, who is responsible for the management of the organization. By working together we wish to demonstrate the commitment the Jesuit order feels towards Fe y Alegría and the intention it has for the organization to thrive.

On the other hand Fe y Alegría is connected to the Education Department of the university and thus is part of the structure of the university. As vice president I am also responsible for strengthening the link between Fe y Alegría and the university, and I think it is a very good link.

On the one hand it allows the Department of Humanist Sciences and the Department of Education to have an education project with a very concrete practical application. In addition, Fe y Alegría Uruguay is a rather new organization, but on the rest of Latin American Fe y Alegría has been working for many years. So the organization has a wealth of experience, which is very beneficial for the Education Department.

What is special about Fe y Alegría programs in comparison with others?

First of all, children need a space where they feel sheltered and safe. These children come from very poor backgrounds, but they have the same right as anyone else to a quality education. So, we strive to continually improve the education we offer. In order to achieve this a lot of effort is put into training teachers and all staff, so that they work just as well as what would be the standard in a middle- or upper-class school.

In addition, our educational plan also includes a religious component. We are not interested in simply replicating the public school system. Uruguay is a country with high school access rates, so we are not simply trying to replicate the public school system and improve it. We are trying to contribute something more. Public school education is completely secular and does not offer the children any instruction in religious values or even religious history. We believe it is our job to contribute in this area by offering education that also enables the meeting with the figure of Jesus Christ.

How do you perceive the tension between Fe y Alegría wanting to educate the poorest sector of the population and at the same time, because it is a private institution, having to charge tuition?

The sums that the students’ families pay are basically symbolic fees. They are minimum dues that do not suffice to cover any costs. But, it is important to create the feeling in people that they have to make a small effort in order to achieve something, and that not everything can be given out for free. Fe y Alegría exists thanks to the domestic businesses and international foundations that make donations to our organization. There are people who realize that this is important work and then decide to help.

How do you perceive the tension between public school education and Fe y Alegría education?

There is definitely a tension. Uruguay has a very homogenizing culture, and there is a widespread attitude that everyone should attend public school. But, the republic’s constitution states that every parent has the right to choose the education she wishes to provide her child, in accordance with her own religious and philosophical beliefs. Nowadays this right is not guaranteed. A person with little economic means has to pay a private school if she wants her child to be schooled in Catholic religion because public schools do not assure this right. The church has always been calling for financial support from the government, as it is common in other Latin American countries. In Uruguay, the survival of Catholic schools is very difficult because most people are unable to pay, and the government does not give the school any money. If there weren’t projects like Fe y Alegría that sustain themselves thanks to the support of people who are willing to fund its programs, this kind of education would be impossible here.

So the goal of Fe y Alegría is to give parents more options when choosing a school for their child?

Yes, we want the parents to be able to choose. Just because they are poor, we should not be taking away their right to choose the type of education that best suits them. The existence of Fe y Alegría makes it possible for parents with limited means to choose between public school and Catholic education. I would not really speak of “private” education, because the tuition they pay is absolutely symbolic. In addition, our schools are open to the public, and no one is rejected because they are not Catholic or are not from the surrounding neighborhood. But we do offer a religious education and an explicit transmission of the Christian message.

What are the biggest challenges Fe y Alegría and the Catholic University face in the coming years?

I think the biggest challenge we face is making the leap towards more formal education and increasing the network of formal schools that are connected with Fe y Alegría. It would also be beneficial to include secondary and technical schools into Fe y Alegría’s network. I think technical education can be an interesting approach that is currently being discovered as a means of reinserting youth into the system who would be on the street if they weren’t provided with a skill set which allowed them to find employment. Making the leap towards this area of education would be very important.

What do you consider the biggest barriers towards realizing this development?

On the one hand there is an ideological question. Secularism is considered an integral part of Uruguay’s identity, and anything that has even a slight religious or Catholic connotation is considered with suspicion. We have had meetings in the Ministry of Education, and these people find it incredibly hard to imagine that a Catholic institution could assume the administration of an educational center that belongs to the public school system. In other countries this is much more common, but here it is basically impossible. So it is an ideological question, because secularism is considered like something sacred.

In addition the economic concerns are real. Since the government does not finance any of our work, we have to pay absolutely everything, as the students’ families can’t contribute much. This is why we need to look for an extensive support network of donors who will allows us to sustain this project which requires extensive funds. It is not an impossible task, but many of our projects are not as extensive as we would like them to be due to these financial constraints.

Can you tell me about the origins of the secular tradition in Uruguay?

At the end of the nineteenth century there was a strong move against the church, influenced by the French thinking, which developed starting at the end of the eighteenth century and developing throughout the nineteenth century. Church was seen as something backward, and there was a strong resistance towards the church’s presence in many public spaces. When this thinking reached Uruguay at the end of the nineteenth century the church here was very small, weak, and had very little structure. So it had very little means of reacting towards the secularist movement.

Later on secularism was strongly identified with one of our presidents, José Valle Ordoñez, who was in office at the beginning of the twentieth century. Valle Ordoñez implemented several laws which caused a continual distancing of the state from the church. The Constitution of 1917 caused the final break between the church and the state, and a systematic marginalization of the church ensued. Much of the work the church had done for education until this point was slowly taken over by the government.

Uruguay has a law stating that education should be secular, free of charge, and obligatory. The interpretation of “secular” however has always been more towards “secularist.” Secular is not seen as something which affirms that the government will not interfere, and everyone can choose her own identity and develop it. Rather, there is a secularist attitude, which aims to deny the church any role in the public realm.

But the church never stopped fighting for its rights. The Catholic University was founded in 1892 and three years later in 1895 was forced to close. One hundred years went by before in 1985 it was again able to open its doors. This happened during a very special time in Uruguay, when the country was transitioning back to democracy after several years of military dictatorship.

Nowadays, while one cannot speak of aggressive secularist attitudes in the government, there is definitely a tendency to slow down and limit anything the church aims to undertake—this is undeniable. In addition there is a lot of indifference. The government will not fight the church, but it won’t pay it any attention or support it either.

The Catholic University does not receive any support at all from the government. This is different in all other Latin American countries, because there the governments understand that the universities perform a public service even though they are private institutions. Private schools actually relieve the government of part of its responsibilities. All the government has to do is ensure the work is done well. Private institutions could contribute and add variety to education in the country.

What is the role of Catholicism in Uruguay’s current social reality?

It is worth fighting for these things. I think it is becoming increasingly evident that in a country that has marginalized all religions, we are also paying the price for a society that is losing some of its fundamental values. Our country is not in bad shape economically and has undergone a significant period of growth. Nonetheless, the levels of violence and social problems in this country are extremely high. This goes hand in hand with a loss of perspective in life.

This is where we as people of faith and as Catholics can try and change something. We are able to contribute in some way towards the improvement of the at times bleak reality of this country. I think education is a very good way to do this—education that generates social mobility and helps people access better opportunities. This is an important element of social justice.