A Discussion with Ali S., Student and Peer Tutor, Jesuit Refugee Service Higher Education Center, Amman, Jordan

With: Ali S. Berkley Center Profile

May 31, 2016

Background: As a part of the Education and Social Justice Project, in May 2016 undergraduate student Jonathan Thrall interviewed Ali S., a student and volunteer peer tutor pursuing the Jesuit Commons: Higher Education at the Margins (JC:HEM) online diploma in liberal studies, implemented by the Jesuit Refugee Service (JRS) in Jordan. In this interview, conducted at the JRS Higher Education Center in Amman, Ali discusses the challenges specific to online higher education, his work as a peer tutor, and the values of respect for all fostered by JRS.
Could you please introduce yourself?

My name is Ali S. I am from Sudan. I am 24 years old, and I am single.

What do you do here at JRS?

I volunteer and study. I am a diploma student in my second year, and I work as a peer tutor helping the [first year diploma] students to improve their writing, prepare class materials with them.

Could you tell me a bit about your background, especially educational and professional?

Actually, I am from Darfur, so I was studying in Darfur. And then suddenly the war erupted, and I stopped going to school for a while. Then I started going back to school, and then I stopped, also for a while. Then, I finished my high school in Khartoum. I was working on the streets, street-side carwash, while I was saving money to get out from Sudan. And then in 2012, December, I came to Jordan. When I came here I did not know any English. I started JRS in 2013 with elementary classes, so I have been following up with the classes until I reached the diploma program. I got involved with every single opportunity I had, whether with JC:HEM or outside of JC:HEM, so I never missed any course.

What were your experiences upon arrival to Jordan?

I didn’t know any Sudanese community here in Jordan. So I when I came, I took the taxi from the airport. I went to al-Balad [downtown Amman]. And then downtown, I did not know where to go. I was walking around, and it was full, and it was raining. And then I just saw some Sudanese, walking. I talked to them, and they said, "Okay, it’s fine. We are just going to host you tonight in our apartment." Then, I stayed with them for two or three months. They took me to the UNHCR office. I registered with the refugee identity, which can protect me. Then, also, they helped find work. I worked, and then I said to myself, since they hosted me at their apartment, "I don’t want to move." I said, "I want to stay with you and keep going with my life."

Are you still living with these same people?

No, not right now. I had been living with them for three years. And then I moved, after three years. Because most of the people I lived with, they traveled to the United States, and then new people came. So that’s why I moved.

Did you face other difficulties during your first few months in Amman?

Yeah, I have faced some difficulties. Like, for example, in December it’s very, very cold here. And since coldness is something new for me—like, in Sudan the weather is not as cold as here. It’s nothing compared to Jordan, so it was a totally new experience for me. And even, after two weeks of my arrival, it snowed. And I never saw snow falling, so it was amazing! I did not feel the coldness of the snow, but I was just amazed. I only saw it on TV; I never saw it in front of me. I am familiar with the rain, but not the snow, the coldness.

And so how is life in general today? Since those experiences, has it changed?

Yeah, it’s totally changed. Like, now I feel like I’m just some steps to reaching my future, my potential in life. Imagine, when I came here, I didn’t speak any English. But now, I am here in front of you, communicating with you. I can understand you. But for the first time when I was here, I never understood any English, any foreign people. I had some basics, some vocab and the alphabet, but not enough to understand someone foreign speaking. But now I am writing papers in English. I can speak. I did some research. I feel I have really fulfilled something.

And I was very committed to my classes; I was never absent from my classes. I was always here, and I worked really hard. And that’s why they gave me the peer tutor position, because I am always here, and I am a very committed person. And I said, "Yes, I want this opportunity." And I learned a lot from my peer tutor position. So I’m not only checking people’s papers, but I am also facilitating the class materials, which is something that’s very good for me, that I enjoy and like. They learn from me, while I also learn from them. It’s like learning from each other.

In general, how’s life in Amman?

You know, it is good for me. As long as I am safe here, nothing matters more than this. Because I escaped insecurity from Sudan, to a safe place. And as long as no one asks me, it’s fine. For sure, I face some difficulties, some...discrimination. Like they discriminate and denigrate us racially. But it’s fine. Discrimination is everywhere. So, I am totally fine with that, no problem. As long as I am safe.

How did you find out about JRS and JC:HEM?

When I came to Jordan, the people I lived with, they were very passionate about learning English. So they motivated me to go with them to [the school in the Ashrafiyeh neighborhood of Amman where JRS ran its educational programs until 2015] to learn English. I went with them, I registered, and I started studying there, and then I found a community there, very kind people. People are very nice, and even the teachers. Like, at first, we couldn’t communicate, we couldn’t understand each other, but then we started, somehow, getting into it. So then, I followed up with the classes. I finished the English courses. Then we had this program, the Community Service Learning Tracks (CSLT). I applied for it, and I passed the exam. Then, I started studying with them in the pre-intermediate course in CSLT.

I studied for four months, and then we had to hand over our final project for the course. And like, the final project was based on computers, and I was not very familiar with computers. You had to record two videos. You had to choose a subject you prefer to talk about, so I chose to talk about human trafficking, then I interviewed two people. One was a victim of human trafficking, and one was a lawyer. So I had two videos, and I had to translate these videos with subtitles, and I am a little bit not familiar with the computers. So it was a little bit challenging for me. But now I have the idea, and it’s fine.

What does learning English mean to you?

Learning English means to me a whole life. You know, English now is an international language. Wherever you go, you can find people out there to communicate with in English. And, even, it creates job opportunities for me because it’s an international language. It’s spoken all over the world. And that’s a very important thing.

How’s the online learning experience?

Wow. It’s a very good question, interesting. Well, as I told you before, I’m not very familiar using computers. So once we started, I didn’t know how to type very well, and there’s a website where you can practice typing online—our tutor came and told us about the website. So what I did is I come everyday, and I give one hour to the typing course. So I type for one hour everyday, and then I start working on my assignments. If I have readings, I sit outside here on these tables, finish my reading, and then go back to the writing. So, like, right now I know how to conduct a research, like how to find articles that I need, Google Scholar, and everything.

And, like, online learning is fantastic. Fantastic. Our university is based in the United States, and we are in Jordan, but through online education, we are doing it. So this means that online learning opens up new doors for people who don’t have access to the onsite education, or are busy working. They don’t have time to go to school, to the universities; they can do their assignments [from] the office or workplace, which is good.

And are you taking this course also with students that are elsewhere?

Yes. The only thing I didn’t like about online learning is someone posts something, and then you may not open the Blackboard [online learning and course management platform] that day, and you may miss their posts, and then you don’t have the opportunity to comment. But if they had something, like an announcement, something it notifies you that someone posts something, that would be good, but not always.

And even if you have online icon so that you can communicate with everyone, that would be good. Because you see someone’s posts and then it gets your attention, and you want to communicate with them. You have some questions, you have some comments, you have feedback, but you comment, and then you can’t get the response until two or three days after. And then you have already forgotten that. But if there is something that tells you that this person is online now, you can have a conversation for two or three hours, and that’s good.

And so how would you characterize your relationships, your relations with your professors?

You know, it’s very distant. You know, sometimes, some professors, you write a paper, you work on a paper for two or three days, and then when you come—let us say the paper is like worth 100 points—sometimes you get 80 or 70 out of 100 ,and then there is only the points, without any feedback. You don’t get feedback. So, like, if the professor says, "I took these points because of this one and this one. You need to work on this area, this one, and this one—one, two, three—so that you can avoid this one in the next paper." But once you don’t get any feedback, you don’t know what are your weaknesses on that and your strengths. But if they tell you, "We took points because of this one, and this idea is not clear, linguistically or grammatically," that would be great.

But for some professors, they are really helpful, they are good. Even if they take one point, they say, "Very excellent job, you did a very excellent job, but there is something here, which is not clear. You have to clarify this," or "You have to work on this," or "This one is grammatically incorrect." So some give you full feedback, and this really motivates the students to keep improving. But it depends on the professors.

On that note, are there any professors you suggest that I get in touch with to speak to?

No, I don’t think so. Like, I can’t even remember their names. Because the interactions between us is not—you know, we are not very close. I can say online education is good. But not to that extent, where you are onsite giving direct comments to your professor, getting direct feedback, which is very good. Because when you get feedback directly in person from your professor, body language plays a fair role, so that you can see in their eyes if they really care or not. And that’s really important for our motivation. So that really matters, when you see that someone really cares.

What are the greatest challenges in your studies through JC:HEM?

The biggest challenge here at JC:HEM is balancing work and your courses. For example, I work eight or nine hours, and then I have to come here to study. You spend the whole day, you come very exhausted, so your mind can’t work. You can’t get new ideas. So, it’s really hard.

But the most important thing is professors think that we are in a [refugee] camp. So in camp, you are just in camp; you are not working. Most of your needs are there, so you are free the whole day. So this is a problem that they think that. Sometimes, you fall behind in your assignments, and then when you ask for an extension, they say, "Mmm...you have to explain why you need that extension," and some of them don’t even reply. So this is a problem, that they think we are in a camp, but we are not in a camp. We are very independent, we don’t get help from UNHCR, we don’t—like, here they reimburse us for transportation, but that’s not enough. People really need financial support also. Because this is a university, you know, these are serious classes; you need to dedicate time for these classes. And since you are working eight or 10 hours a day, you cannot balance...you won’t do your best in these courses.

On that note, could you describe your study habits? How do you in fact balance your studies and work?

You know, it depends on the situation. For example, once I started on the diploma program, I was working around eight hours. So what I did was I tried very hard and find a job near the center. So I go to the work. Once I get out of work, I came directly to the center, see what’s new, work on my assignments, then go home. But right now, I have very big gap time; you can say I am totally free. I am always here. My work is just to check students' writing. And then if someone doesn’t understand their assignments, what to write, that’s my job, to make them understand what’s going on. And if no one is asking for help, I will be working on my assignments. And sometimes if someone doesn’t ask me, I will ask them, "Is there any problem? Do you need any help?" If yes, I help them for five, 10 minutes, half an hour, hour. Then, it’s fine, I work on my own assignments.

How much time do you spend tutoring a week?

So I volunteer here only 15 hours a week, but also if I am here and I am free, I never hesitate to help someone who is in need of help. I am always there for them. Because I am not only doing this for them, but also for myself!

On that note, what’s your greatest source of motivation in your studies here at JC:HEM?

What motivates me is once I start the class, finish it, I get a good grade. And once I apply for the second one, I pass it. So this motivates me to keep going. I never failed any course: all the courses I applied for, I passed them. Every time I finish a course, I just take some rest because I have to start a new class, which is a good motivation.

And what about your volunteer work as a tutor, what motivates you in that?

I have already done all the courses they [the first year students] are doing right now. So every time I check with the students, a paper or a discussion post or a journal, you know, it takes me back to my own work so I see, "Oh! I did this one last year—this idea is different than mine. Oh, good, this is new!" So I learn a lot. I am just doing one thing twice, you know, let me have a stronger and better understanding of this subject.

And so you do like that you’re working on one subject, one course at a time?

Yes, yes.

What does “social justice” mean to you?

Social justice to me is, like, we have "social." So, I am a part of this social community, you are a part of it, so we are all equal. And so justice means treating all humans, all people, all the community in the same way. So social justice to me is like treating people around you, around the community, as you want yourself to be treated.

Do you think that social justice plays a role at JRS—in your studies or at the center in general?

Yes, you know, because we come from many different backgrounds, religions, and even ethnicities. So since we are very different, we speak differently, and we have different perspectives and ideas. And so being in such a community really needs social justice. So, yeah, it plays a big role. And then if everyone knows about social justice, so they respect. So, like, I am from a different culture. I may do something totally acceptable in my culture but not acceptable in your culture, and we both have to understand this. And if you don’t understand this, things will turn upside down at this social center. So we have to learn from each other, everyone’s culture.

At the end, we are human, and this is the very common thing between us. So we don’t have to treat each other based on our own cultures but based on something we have in common, which is humanity. Even not based on religion, only humanity. I am human, you are human, and we have to respect each other. So, your religion belongs to you, you have it. And my religion belongs to me. But humanity for all. So nothing comes before humanity.

Are there any core ideals, values that are emphasized in your program?

Yes, for example, we have the academic integrity, which is a core for any academic class. So academic integrity comes first. You shouldn’t plagiarize; this is at the top of any educational system or place. You don’t take someone’s ideas and use as yours. You can use someone’s ideas, but you have to cite them. Because even if you took it as your own, you cannot explain as their owner because they wrote it. They know how to explain it and everything. And so we should know that you took this idea because you know that they can put it better than you can. You have to give the credit back. This is very important.

And, since from the very beginning of the program, we have been told that everyone should respect each other. Because they know that we come from very different backgrounds, so respecting each other is a core value here. Once you respect each other, you are doing more than respecting each other; there are core values behind this one. But respect comes first. If you don’t accept me as a person, you won’t respect me, you won’t help me. But if you accept me as a person, or as a human being like you, that’s it, we come to a common ground.

So, is that something that’s more so emphasized by the people here at the center? Or is it something that you see more so emphasized in your studies?

I think more by the people than by what we study. But then, for instance, in philosophy course, we learned about justice, compassion, all these values, which was good. So for sure we were respecting each other but then, once we finished this course, the amount of respect has increased—you can say has doubled. So what we study also emphasizes this.

Is there anything that you would do to improve the JRS/JC:HEM experience?

For me, yeah, sure. What I can say is that we study many different courses. So, for example, we are studying international relations. You’ve mastered it; you know a lot about it. You can teach me some subjects in international relations, for example foreign policy or diplomacy. But if I asked someone who has studied, let’s say, only mathematics, he can’t help me in this area. So that’s a problem we face sometimes: you have your onsite coordinator, but they don’t sometimes know much about some courses. What I recommend is, when we have courses, for example science, or some course that the onsite coordinator is not familiar with, they can hire someone who has ideas or is familiar with that course, to help students do their best with that subject.

So get the onsite coordinators and tutors to know the diploma curriculum even more?

Even more, yes.

Or have some way to have somebody, because of the distant contact with the professor, who knows more about certain subjects?

Yeah. Sometimes our assignments have due dates. And then if you send an email to your professor saying, "I don’t understand this. I need help in this area," you send it to her today, and then your assignment is due two days or three days after, and then she responds to you after four days. So this is a problem. Really, we need someone to be onsite, and it’s good to have someone who you can go to when you’re really in need of something, you’re in a rush because you can’t wait until the due date. Then if you didn’t submit your assignment, your paper, on time, you know the professor might take off some points. And sometimes this is not my problem; I don’t understand what I should do. I have to ask, and when I ask, I don’t get the response. But, you know, it doesn’t have to be perfect.

What do these studies mean to you, and how do you hope to use them?

So, I learned a lot from the course I took, so I want to keep studying, even if not here. I really want to finish the program, the whole three years. I want to get my diploma, and then I want to concentrate on social work, you know, give back what I’ve learned from this program to my community. My community could be where I live, or somewhere else, so it doesn’t have to be my community in Sudan. Wherever I am and wherever people need help, I will definitely help.

Is there anything that we didn’t discuss that you want to add?

Most of the students, they start the program, and then after two to three months or five months, they drop out. So, for example, [the cohort that started the diploma program in 2015], they were 40 students, and now they haven’t finished the first year yet, and they are not even 20 right now. So, there’s a problem, there’s a real problem. Why did these students drop out? And as I’ve mentioned before, people need financial support. Not even only financial support, they also need someone to motivate them, to keep them going.


For example, once we started, we used to discuss everything, the weekly materials—we have a whole week, so we come all together, the students, sit down, discuss everything. If there’s something that doesn’t make sense for you [but] it makes sense for me, then I will explain it to you. So you will have a better idea of what it’s about. So discussing everything together is very important, because you learn from each other, and once you finish the discussion, you will have a full understanding of the week. You can start off, but if you don’t have an understanding, you will start writing and you will stop in the middle, and you can’t continue because you lack ideas.

So you’re saying that doesn’t happen enough? That students should discuss more?

Yes, if not two days, one day they can come. Some things are easy and some things are challenging, so if they come and see what is really difficult for them, they can discuss it with their site coordinator so give examples, give ideas. Everyone gives their own opinion about the topic; that would be good. Because, I’m sure, there are some people that don’t understand everything from the assignments but then, coming all together and discussing, we will get out something that can help you to continue doing your assignments.
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