Background: As part of the Peacebuilding Practitioners Interview Series, Jason Klocek interviewed Emmanuel Sebit, S.J., who was ordained a priest of the Roman Catholic Church in 2002 and runs a civic education program and an HIV/AIDS awareness program. In this interview, Sebit provides a Catholic view on the challenges of reconciliation in Yei. He also discusses the role of the Catholic Church in promoting peace during the decades-long conflict.
Fr. Sebit, can you first speak about your background and how these experiences led to your current work in Yei?
You are welcome, Jason Klocek. The peace has given us a chance to be opened to new corridors in the world after we have been closed off from them for all the time of the war, isolated from the rest of our brothers and sisters in the world. This is the first time that somebody has made this kind of interview with me, and I am approaching you as new friends.
As you might be able to tell from my name, I was born in the north, near Khartoum. There I joined the seminary. It is the only major seminary in the country, so it is for all nine Catholic dioceses. In 2001 I finished my theological studies. A year later, I was ordained a priest in Juba, but for the diocese of Yei. However, I first worked for three years in the Archdiocese of Juba. Then, in 2005 the bishop called me to serve as the pastoral coordinator for the Diocese of Yei.
Can you please speak about the Diocese of Yei?
The diocese was established in 1986 and is quite large, covering an area of about 40,000 square kilometers, with more than half a million inhabitants. We are located in the extreme end of southern Sudan, bordering Uganda to the south and the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) to the southwest. In addition to the indigenous people, there are about 200,000 internally displaced persons (IDPs) from the other neighboring regions of the Sudan.
The Diocese of Yei is the youngest diocese in the country among the nine dioceses of the Sudan. The diocese is a very vast area, covering seven counties. It has seven parishes operating in full swing. Right from the time of its creation the diocese never found a suitable stability due to the ups and downs of the civil war in southern Sudan. Almost the whole of the diocese was scattered to the bush and the neighboring countries of Uganda and the DRC.
Despite the fact that the diocese was born during the civil war and people were living in great difficulties, the diocese still grew and the pastoral dimensions were carried out, although with poor means of evangelization. With the signing of the Comprehensive Peace Agreement (CPA) between the Sudanese government and the Sudan Peoples’ Liberation Movement (SPLM) on January 9, 2005, the inhabitants of Yei, including the refugees, the IDPs, and their shepherds (bishop, priests, and [men and women] religious), moved into their parishes and home villages. They came from northern Sudan and the neighboring countries of Uganda and the DRC. They have started rehabilitation and reconstruction work.
Hence the diocese is concerned and would like to contribute in this vital process of nation-building and the pastoral and spiritual rehabilitation and growth of the people of God. Unfortunately the lack of efficient means of evangelization and pastoral work have become an obstacle in achieving this goal. Hence the diocese is seeking the support of friends.
What does your work as pastoral coordinator involve?
Mainly I focus on training the people of our diocese, the laity, with a special focus on our youth and women. We do this through two main programs—a civic education program and an HIV/AIDS awareness program. The civic education program is focused on helping people in their daily lives, to recognize the signs of the times. Our HIV/AIDS awareness work involves one- to two-week trainings. We bring three or four people here from each of the seven parishes in the diocese and teach them about the seriousness of this problem, as well as train them to go back to their communities so as to sensitize them to this issue. Many people still deny the fact of this disease, so this work is important.
Also we help catechists in their formation as Catholics, but this is not so easy here. We can only do short-term training. For more long-term training we send people to Arua, Uganda. Finally, we do some training of the laity for service in the Church, such as extraordinary ministers of holy communion during Mass.
Does any of your work focus on reconciliation?
Our civic education program includes trainings on peace and reconciliation. Similar to the process for the workshops on HIV/AIDS, we also bring three or four people from each of the seven parishes to complete workshops and trainings on peace and reconciliation. We teach people the basics, the ABCs, of reconciliation and work with them to face the realities of their lives, including the day-to-day conflicts in which they are engaged.
Do you coordinate with other organizations on any of these trainings?
Just recently, in 2007 and 2008, we ran trainings on leadership, conflict resolution skills, and peacebuilding. We coordinated with the United Nations Development Programmed (UNDP) on these trainings and also discussed the rule of law issues.
What challenges have you faced doing these workshops and trainings?
Well, first of all, our work is not systematic. We do what we can, when we can do it. Of course, resources are limited for everyone. It is the seam when coordinating with other groups: if people have the resources, we may work with them, but this is not done regularly or systematically.
Also, there is no follow-up to these trainings. And, often people don’t know what to do with the knowledge they gain. Many people come with such high expectations. They expect to be offered some sort of employment after their training. However, this is not our purpose. Our objective is to train people because we think the knowledge alone is important. They can apply it to their own lives and in their communities. Still, so often I hear the same complaint, “You train us, but then don’t find us a job.”
In the end, we try to give our parishioners the basics about peace and reconciliation or HIV/AIDS awareness and train them to share this information. Our hope is that they will go back into the community and share this information, sensitize their communities to these issues. Most people lack even the basic knowledge of their situation. Plus, there are many people who have suffered various traumas and need support. So often people use the language of war to talk about even day-to-day things. We hope to change this and help people to use the language of human beings, the language of hope.
What role did the Catholic Church play during the war?
The Church never stopped talking during the war. It called for peace. And today no one denies the role of the Church in helping to bring that peace—not the government in the north or the south.
You know, those were very tough times. In the south there was the problem of the army, of violence and guns. But, in the north, just being a Christian seemed like a crime. I remember myself what it was like. For example, in schools Christians were given lower marks, which then prevented them from going on to further studies. Many Christians could not get jobs either. Many people gave up and turned away from their faith. Even today people I knew growing up are surprised to see that I am a priest.
In the end, the international community did much to help. They showed that some of the real problems of the war were about religion, language (being forced to speak Arabic), and racism. For a very long time, the government in the north denied the existence of Christians in Sudan. I believe it was the visit to Khartoum in 1993 by the late holy father, John Paul II, that brought an end to that lie. More than one million people attended the open air Mass during his visit. There was no way one could deny that Christians were in Sudan after that. This was the start of the international community finally starting to help the marginalized people of Sudan.
Also, the bishops of Sudan were very important. They had more freedom to travel than government leaders at the time. And every time our bishops traveled they spoke out against the injustices in the country. They spoke to journalists, aid agencies, and other governments. They told the true story of life here. They were very much the voice of the voiceless. And they still have not stopped talking.
What is the Catholic Church now saying about peace and reconciliation in Sudan?
The Church continues to speak out on the issues of peace and reconciliation. Just this past November, in 2008, the Sudan Catholic Bishops’ Conference issued a pastoral letter entitled “Be Messengers of Peace.” This pastoral letter is very important because it is not only addressed to Christians, but to all people in Sudan, including the government in Khartoum. The bishops speak of many of the difficult issues we are facing today, such as continued conflict due to tribalism and corruption in the government. They also speak about the CPA, respect for the human dignity of others, and the need for peace and reconciliation. Of course, no one knows what will happen, but it is our role to speak out on such things.
In what ways have you responded to this pastoral letter?
Many people do not understand the CPA. They don’t understand the difference between the forthcoming elections and referendum. Many think they are the same things. And there are those that seek to take advantage of these people. Maybe they have a hidden agenda and don’t tell the people the whole truth. Maybe they will simply pay people to vote a certain way. So I try even in my sermons on Sundays, when everyone comes together as a community, to preach on these issues, to talk about what these things are and the choices people can make. There are many people that still must be educated on these issues.
What are some of the other challenges to reconciliation in Yei?
Reconciliation is something that is very important, and it is for all people. It is about harmony. But many people have wounds from the war, and I don’t only mean physical ones. Today people don’t even blame the war necessarily for their problems; they blame individuals. So our biggest challenge is finding ways to bring people together.
Then, we have other problems—some the result of the war, some part of the day-to-day conflicts in our society. One of the big issues still remaining from the war is property rights. Many people fled the south during the war, and other people took control of their land. Maybe it is someone who didn’t leave, or maybe someone who fled from the north but didn’t cross into one of the bordering countries. With the signing of the CPA, many people have returned to Yei, and it is unclear how these land disputes are to be settled. The person now controlling the land says to the one who fled, "Where were you when we were suffering?"
Our economic situation is another major challenge, though not necessarily only a result of the war. There seems to be a trend towards wanting to buy everything from Uganda or Kenya. Our people produce very little. And, of course, this favors those who control such resources or those who can afford to buy such goods, so they do not work to change this system. But, the majority of people cannot afford these things. It would be helpful if this trading was regulated or if people were encouraged to farm more. As for regulation, if we simply stopped the trading today, there would not be enough resources here for people to survive. I think about how in the United States the government protects its farmers, how it offers them subsidies. Here there is no such protection, and so people are not encouraged to produce more of their own goods.
Also, farming creates a new problem—this one between those who farm and those who graze their animals. Often times these animals will eat what someone is trying to grow. To the west there is now fighting about his very issue, and this is between Muslims themselves. It is a dispute between cattle owners and farmers.
Finally, one other problem concerns marriage dowries. In some places, if a man cannot afford the dowry to marry he will go and steal the animals of another person, usually in a different village and of a different tribe.
All of these issues need to be addressed systematically by the government. But, as things stand now, people are simply left free to do as they like.
So government regulation is not enough to secure the peace?
More government control is important, but it is not enough. Our government is still “green.” By this, I mean it is still growing; it lacks much experience. The government must also learn how to check itself and curb corruption. Just recently there has been delaying of salaries as the money that should be paid to some people goes somewhere else.
You know, I am now a priest of seven years, but I don’t pretend to know everything. I know when to ask for help. We in Sudan, of course, also need help. We need to support one another. And this is not only about material resources, although this is one important part. There is also spiritual and intellectual support. I often tell people that I am giving them intellectual support so that they can learn how to make decisions on their own and defend themselves.
Fr. Sebit, thank you very much for your time today.
You are welcome, Jason Klocek. The peace has given us a chance to be opened to new corridors in the world after we have been closed off from them for all the time of the war, isolated from the rest of our brothers and sisters in the world. This is the first time that somebody has made this kind of interview with me, and I am approaching you as new friends.
As you might be able to tell from my name, I was born in the north, near Khartoum. There I joined the seminary. It is the only major seminary in the country, so it is for all nine Catholic dioceses. In 2001 I finished my theological studies. A year later, I was ordained a priest in Juba, but for the diocese of Yei. However, I first worked for three years in the Archdiocese of Juba. Then, in 2005 the bishop called me to serve as the pastoral coordinator for the Diocese of Yei.
Can you please speak about the Diocese of Yei?
The diocese was established in 1986 and is quite large, covering an area of about 40,000 square kilometers, with more than half a million inhabitants. We are located in the extreme end of southern Sudan, bordering Uganda to the south and the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) to the southwest. In addition to the indigenous people, there are about 200,000 internally displaced persons (IDPs) from the other neighboring regions of the Sudan.
The Diocese of Yei is the youngest diocese in the country among the nine dioceses of the Sudan. The diocese is a very vast area, covering seven counties. It has seven parishes operating in full swing. Right from the time of its creation the diocese never found a suitable stability due to the ups and downs of the civil war in southern Sudan. Almost the whole of the diocese was scattered to the bush and the neighboring countries of Uganda and the DRC.
Despite the fact that the diocese was born during the civil war and people were living in great difficulties, the diocese still grew and the pastoral dimensions were carried out, although with poor means of evangelization. With the signing of the Comprehensive Peace Agreement (CPA) between the Sudanese government and the Sudan Peoples’ Liberation Movement (SPLM) on January 9, 2005, the inhabitants of Yei, including the refugees, the IDPs, and their shepherds (bishop, priests, and [men and women] religious), moved into their parishes and home villages. They came from northern Sudan and the neighboring countries of Uganda and the DRC. They have started rehabilitation and reconstruction work.
Hence the diocese is concerned and would like to contribute in this vital process of nation-building and the pastoral and spiritual rehabilitation and growth of the people of God. Unfortunately the lack of efficient means of evangelization and pastoral work have become an obstacle in achieving this goal. Hence the diocese is seeking the support of friends.
What does your work as pastoral coordinator involve?
Mainly I focus on training the people of our diocese, the laity, with a special focus on our youth and women. We do this through two main programs—a civic education program and an HIV/AIDS awareness program. The civic education program is focused on helping people in their daily lives, to recognize the signs of the times. Our HIV/AIDS awareness work involves one- to two-week trainings. We bring three or four people here from each of the seven parishes in the diocese and teach them about the seriousness of this problem, as well as train them to go back to their communities so as to sensitize them to this issue. Many people still deny the fact of this disease, so this work is important.
Also we help catechists in their formation as Catholics, but this is not so easy here. We can only do short-term training. For more long-term training we send people to Arua, Uganda. Finally, we do some training of the laity for service in the Church, such as extraordinary ministers of holy communion during Mass.
Does any of your work focus on reconciliation?
Our civic education program includes trainings on peace and reconciliation. Similar to the process for the workshops on HIV/AIDS, we also bring three or four people from each of the seven parishes to complete workshops and trainings on peace and reconciliation. We teach people the basics, the ABCs, of reconciliation and work with them to face the realities of their lives, including the day-to-day conflicts in which they are engaged.
Do you coordinate with other organizations on any of these trainings?
Just recently, in 2007 and 2008, we ran trainings on leadership, conflict resolution skills, and peacebuilding. We coordinated with the United Nations Development Programmed (UNDP) on these trainings and also discussed the rule of law issues.
What challenges have you faced doing these workshops and trainings?
Well, first of all, our work is not systematic. We do what we can, when we can do it. Of course, resources are limited for everyone. It is the seam when coordinating with other groups: if people have the resources, we may work with them, but this is not done regularly or systematically.
Also, there is no follow-up to these trainings. And, often people don’t know what to do with the knowledge they gain. Many people come with such high expectations. They expect to be offered some sort of employment after their training. However, this is not our purpose. Our objective is to train people because we think the knowledge alone is important. They can apply it to their own lives and in their communities. Still, so often I hear the same complaint, “You train us, but then don’t find us a job.”
In the end, we try to give our parishioners the basics about peace and reconciliation or HIV/AIDS awareness and train them to share this information. Our hope is that they will go back into the community and share this information, sensitize their communities to these issues. Most people lack even the basic knowledge of their situation. Plus, there are many people who have suffered various traumas and need support. So often people use the language of war to talk about even day-to-day things. We hope to change this and help people to use the language of human beings, the language of hope.
What role did the Catholic Church play during the war?
The Church never stopped talking during the war. It called for peace. And today no one denies the role of the Church in helping to bring that peace—not the government in the north or the south.
You know, those were very tough times. In the south there was the problem of the army, of violence and guns. But, in the north, just being a Christian seemed like a crime. I remember myself what it was like. For example, in schools Christians were given lower marks, which then prevented them from going on to further studies. Many Christians could not get jobs either. Many people gave up and turned away from their faith. Even today people I knew growing up are surprised to see that I am a priest.
In the end, the international community did much to help. They showed that some of the real problems of the war were about religion, language (being forced to speak Arabic), and racism. For a very long time, the government in the north denied the existence of Christians in Sudan. I believe it was the visit to Khartoum in 1993 by the late holy father, John Paul II, that brought an end to that lie. More than one million people attended the open air Mass during his visit. There was no way one could deny that Christians were in Sudan after that. This was the start of the international community finally starting to help the marginalized people of Sudan.
Also, the bishops of Sudan were very important. They had more freedom to travel than government leaders at the time. And every time our bishops traveled they spoke out against the injustices in the country. They spoke to journalists, aid agencies, and other governments. They told the true story of life here. They were very much the voice of the voiceless. And they still have not stopped talking.
What is the Catholic Church now saying about peace and reconciliation in Sudan?
The Church continues to speak out on the issues of peace and reconciliation. Just this past November, in 2008, the Sudan Catholic Bishops’ Conference issued a pastoral letter entitled “Be Messengers of Peace.” This pastoral letter is very important because it is not only addressed to Christians, but to all people in Sudan, including the government in Khartoum. The bishops speak of many of the difficult issues we are facing today, such as continued conflict due to tribalism and corruption in the government. They also speak about the CPA, respect for the human dignity of others, and the need for peace and reconciliation. Of course, no one knows what will happen, but it is our role to speak out on such things.
In what ways have you responded to this pastoral letter?
Many people do not understand the CPA. They don’t understand the difference between the forthcoming elections and referendum. Many think they are the same things. And there are those that seek to take advantage of these people. Maybe they have a hidden agenda and don’t tell the people the whole truth. Maybe they will simply pay people to vote a certain way. So I try even in my sermons on Sundays, when everyone comes together as a community, to preach on these issues, to talk about what these things are and the choices people can make. There are many people that still must be educated on these issues.
What are some of the other challenges to reconciliation in Yei?
Reconciliation is something that is very important, and it is for all people. It is about harmony. But many people have wounds from the war, and I don’t only mean physical ones. Today people don’t even blame the war necessarily for their problems; they blame individuals. So our biggest challenge is finding ways to bring people together.
Then, we have other problems—some the result of the war, some part of the day-to-day conflicts in our society. One of the big issues still remaining from the war is property rights. Many people fled the south during the war, and other people took control of their land. Maybe it is someone who didn’t leave, or maybe someone who fled from the north but didn’t cross into one of the bordering countries. With the signing of the CPA, many people have returned to Yei, and it is unclear how these land disputes are to be settled. The person now controlling the land says to the one who fled, "Where were you when we were suffering?"
Our economic situation is another major challenge, though not necessarily only a result of the war. There seems to be a trend towards wanting to buy everything from Uganda or Kenya. Our people produce very little. And, of course, this favors those who control such resources or those who can afford to buy such goods, so they do not work to change this system. But, the majority of people cannot afford these things. It would be helpful if this trading was regulated or if people were encouraged to farm more. As for regulation, if we simply stopped the trading today, there would not be enough resources here for people to survive. I think about how in the United States the government protects its farmers, how it offers them subsidies. Here there is no such protection, and so people are not encouraged to produce more of their own goods.
Also, farming creates a new problem—this one between those who farm and those who graze their animals. Often times these animals will eat what someone is trying to grow. To the west there is now fighting about his very issue, and this is between Muslims themselves. It is a dispute between cattle owners and farmers.
Finally, one other problem concerns marriage dowries. In some places, if a man cannot afford the dowry to marry he will go and steal the animals of another person, usually in a different village and of a different tribe.
All of these issues need to be addressed systematically by the government. But, as things stand now, people are simply left free to do as they like.
So government regulation is not enough to secure the peace?
More government control is important, but it is not enough. Our government is still “green.” By this, I mean it is still growing; it lacks much experience. The government must also learn how to check itself and curb corruption. Just recently there has been delaying of salaries as the money that should be paid to some people goes somewhere else.
You know, I am now a priest of seven years, but I don’t pretend to know everything. I know when to ask for help. We in Sudan, of course, also need help. We need to support one another. And this is not only about material resources, although this is one important part. There is also spiritual and intellectual support. I often tell people that I am giving them intellectual support so that they can learn how to make decisions on their own and defend themselves.
Fr. Sebit, thank you very much for your time today.
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