Background: As part of the Education and Social Justice Project, in June 2024, undergraduate student Minahil Mahmud (SFS’26) interviewed Stefan Kukrić, administrator and coordinator of the Let’s Step Forward Together program at the John Paul II Youth Pastoral Center in Sarajevo, Bosnia and Herzegovina. In this interview, Stefan describes how the center builds bridges among young Bosnians of different faiths through dialogue, friendship, and youth‑led initiatives.
Okay, can we start with you telling me about yourself and your background?
My name is Stefan. I was born in 1998, in a small town here near Sarajevo, about 30 kilometers from Sarajevo. And I finished my primary school in my hometown. And then I came here to Sarajevo in high school. After that, I went to university. I studied theology and philosophy here. For four years, I was in pre-seminary. After I left seminary, and after I finished my final year at my college, I started to work here in Youth Center. If you need more information about me, you should ask what else you want to hear about me. I’m a musician, I’m a philosopher, I’m a theologian. Yeah, I'm working here for the center for two years.
You’re like a renaissance man. Thank you for sharing that. So what first motivated you to get involved here at the Youth Center?
I started with Youth Center 10 years ago, when I was in my primary school and high school, I started to do some activities. And I felt a lot of beautiful things about the center and about the youth people here. And I started with some activities because there was a lot of new friends and new people with different backgrounds and everything. And after participating in activities, I started to work here. And I had a feeling that I belong here, and this is my place. That's the reason why I'm here and why I want to do this.
That's so lucky, I think, that you found yourself here as a participant, and then you wanted to stay.
Yes. And I'm not a priest, at my college. This is, if I can say that, only job I can do. Because it's related to everything I studied. College theology and pastoral theology and psychology and pedagogy. So this is the perfect place for me in that professional way.
You're able to make use of all your skills here. That's very good. And how would you describe your current role here with regards to the interfaith program?
Okay, this interfaith program project, and project coordinator since end of April or beginning of May. So, it's really short time because I started working here three years ago, as a project coordinator for other projects, a lot of projects, the support people with disabilities. And I also worked on this project in a generation of leadership in our church. So with younger makers, youth workers, and older servants, and seminaries, young priest, and when my colleague left this youth center, they choose me for this interreligious project. So, now I'm coordinator for administrative things, for financial things, and also for activities and educators. And that's my main job here. So, I'm coordinating this project and figure out smaller projects. Because I started to work here three years ago, so I'm not new anymore. So I'm helping my younger colleagues with the project.
Was it a natural transition for you from your previous role to this new leadership role?
Completely different. Just, it's not a different view in my job because I did all those things before, or so that topics is different. So I have to change my mindset now and go inside, deeper inside. As a theologian, I have worked a lot interreligious dialogue, and I know main things about it, but it's short time for me in this project. So now, I'm, I'm still searching things. Yeah, but it is the exact same job. We can use a few things.
So it’s a new position but you're finding your feet. Thank you for sharing that. How would you describe the goal of the interreligious project? What is it trying to achieve?
We want to, we want something for you people hearing. And the main goal is for them to be together as one without differences, without borders, without problems. Even they have different religions and backgrounds and everything. The main goal is to be together and be friends. And also, as Pope Francis said here, in 2015, our main goal of project is to build bridges, not walls. That’s the main goal here.
Yeah, that seems to be the guiding philosophy for the program, definitely.
Also, we've had last week, summer camp, building bridges. So that's something we see as our goal.
I'm really glad that I was able to see the camp because I saw all the workshops and activities take place and I could see this philosophy really come alive. So yeah, definitely. What do you believe is the connection between religion or faith and peacebuilding in Bosnia specifically? What's the connection between these two things?
Willing young people to do it. Because if you don't have young people who don't want to live together, work together, you won't have you will have [sic] beautiful society and community, you will have fights and problems. So yeah, I can see that I think young people want to be together, that there's a theme that can connect everything here.
I guess what I'm trying to understand is why connect them on the basis of religion? Why do you think the inter-religious project is important?
Because it's important. Religion is really important for people. Because we are in that part of the world where religion is really important. If you moved to West, Western Europe, and then USA or something like that, they have another things in their heads. For us, religion is important because you're part of the kind of old war world. And here in Bosnia, we also have problem with, about differences between religion and nationalities. Because for people here in Bosnia and Herzegovina, it's the same. So if you are Serb, you should be Orthodox. It's not. It's not true, because you can be mostly on Serb, and you can be Catholic or Muslim. But people here, they don't understand that in that way. So, religion and nationality here, unfortunately, is the same thing. And that's why we are trying through this project, into a religious project, to bring young people here together. Because if you work on that nationality side, and if you invite Croats and Bosniaks, Serbs will tell you that they are, what’s the word, discriminated. And if you will Serbs and Bosniaks, Croats will say they are discriminate. When you, when you have young people with different religion, they are here together, no matter about nationality. So this is the main reason why we are doing that religion part of this community, not that national.
Thank you for explaining that. That really contextualizes the importance of religion as, I guess, a tool that you can use here.
Trust me, it's very important, religion is very important. You spent some days here in Sarajevo, and you can see that Sarajevo is 50% Muslim people. And you also had a chance to be here at your biggest celebration. And you saw that all people here, they're going to mosque in Herzegovina, or some other parts like in Herzegovina, you will see all people on Sunday, they're going to church. And in northern part, Republic of Srpska, they are going on liturgy at Sunday. So religion is really early [sic] important. And when it's some religion day, we won’t work. Shops don't work. So it’s really important. That's why you should bring people together through religion, because in Bosnia and Herzegovina, we have three religions. So Catholics, and Orthodox, and Muslims, and also Jews, we are part of that religion that has faith in one God. So we are brothers and sisters. And that's the image, what we want to show young people through this project, that we are part of brotherhood, and sisterhood. Because we have the same father, you know, Abraham. So there's a reason why religion is important.
Definitely. That really helps me understand why religion is at the center of the program. What do you think is the role of faith-based organizations like this in Bosnia in general?
They're really important, but they are not visible in eyes of like, if I can say that way, because if you don't have help of your government or something like that, of religion organizations and institutions, you can say that you are not visible. But we are doing a lot of, not good, great. And this youth center is not only one here in Bosnia and Herzegovina. Here in Sarajevo, we have also Muslim Youth Center and Eastern Sarajevo, we have Orthodox Youth Center. So we are striving for and it's really important to have religious institutions and organizations who will work with, will work with them. But the problem in this country is because we are, in our law, we are not equal. This is not country with religious laws, like in Saudi Arabia or something like that. In different parts of this country, we have some problems and issues with work. But we are fighting to be here, somewhere around. But it’s important to have organizations like this.
What did you mean when you were talking about not having religious laws? How does that fit into the picture? You compare the absence of religious laws in Bosnia to places like Saudi Arabia where perhaps religion is more visible. Would you say that's why faith based organizations are relevant here? What's the connection there?
Okay. When you have a country with religious laws, religion institutions are really important. Okay. When you have a country, secular country, religious institutions and organizations are not important. They are important just in a religious way, for religious people, or church, or Islamic community, for Jews’ community, Orthodox Church, but not for country. That is difference between secular and religious country. And that's why we are not visible in secular countries, because we are, you know, you're splitted in two ways. So you have the secular side with nationalities and laws and politicians and everything, and you have religious parts of this country, and they are not equal. In religious country, non-secular countries, like Saudi Arabia, you have just this. If you have Muslim youth center in Saudi Arabia, they are visible, they are rich and wealthy, and they will do with the kids whatever.
So you think religion is on the back seat here in Bosnia. It doesn't take priority. It's just for religious people.
Yes. Just for religious people. In that part. In religious part, it's really important. Not for country.
Okay, thank you for clarifying that. I asked because I was thinking of places like America, for example, where the church and the state are very separate, like they don't let religion get involved in the government whatsoever.
It’s the same. Because in past, you had situations when kings elected pope or bishops or religious guidance. He chose it. Same as here in Bosnia and Herzegovina. During the Austrian Hungarian empire. czar from Vienna, he choose archbishop here in Sarajevo. Now, in secular country, Catholic Church with pope chooses the bishop here in Sarajevo and bishop can’t involve in politics, parliament, or something like that. During the history, priests and bishops and Imams and religious teachers, they were involved in politics. They were next to kings. Now, you don't have it. And that's why in USA, as you said, they are completely different because like president can just put his hand on Bible or Quran and say I swear, and that's it. That's secular country. And that is reason why religious institutions, and church, and Islamic community, and everything, they are really separated. On the back seat. Country and government is here, and religion is here. But in people mindset, is completely different.
So there's a gap there that people can feel? Yes. Yeah. Okay. That's very interesting.
As a Croat, it’s really important to have Croatian president in our presidency of Bosnia and Herzegovina. And it’s not important if you’re going through the religion side of society. So it's really important who is your priest or parish and who is your bishop? So it's always like this. Nationality, religion.
Interesting. Interesting. So it's like you're juggling two different-
If you ask about politic here, it's important about nationality. If you ask about religion, it’s important about your religion.
So you mentioned before that because religion is not prioritized by the government, I guess, because it’s kept separate from the government, youth centers or faith centers like this don't get enough support. So what other challenges would you say that the Youth Center has to face in doing the work that it's done? Like have there been any obstacles in doing the work that you do here? Any challenges in running the program?
A lot of challenges. A lot of young people are going outside the country. And less young people here. This problem with our politics, politicians, so that's one of the challenges we are facing, and the biggest. You can find financial resources from outside as we do, from Germany and USA. It's not about people, it’s problem about the technical support. And also we have a big challenges this year at center with young Catholics. Because they are lost in their faith. So we need to solve that gap between church and young people, between priests and young people, between us and young people. So we have a lot of stuff, small challenges, but the biggest is that we don’t have more young people. In Sarajevo, before war, you have more than half a million people. But now you have maybe 250,000 after the war and deaths situation in Bosnia and Herzegovina.
So it sounds to me like it's the job of the youth center to act as the connection between young people and religious leaders as well as the rest of society? Would that be accurate?
That’s our goal.
So how have you seen these young people, when they come to the program, and they take part in all these activities, how would you describe their interactions with each other? Because a lot of them, they're meeting each other for the first time, they're coming from different parts of Bosnia and they would have never met each other in any other scenario. So, how have you seen them interact?
First two days, they are shy. Third day, they are together, they are already friends. And they're special because they want it, but they don't have opportunity in their hometown to have that. They really want it, and they need interaction with young people from another religion. That’s the most beautiful thing I can see. And not just in this interreligious project, every project you have young people from different backgrounds, from different communities, from different families and everything with a different mindset. And in a few days, or a few meetings, they can meet their friends. And you can see that they really need it and they really want it. You just have to give them a chance.
I can tell from your body language, even, that you feel very passionately about this.
Yeah, when I go somewhere outside this country, that’s what I will say to all people. Because they want to know what we are doing. That’s the only thing. We are giving them a chance. To make this country better. If they want to. They really want it. They just don’t have enough space. When you go to faculty, you just sit and listen to professor and that’s it. When you come here, you have interactions with other people. You can exchange ideas and plans. You can make friends with people from the same country, from the same space.
That’s such a simple but powerful goal. All you need to do is bring these people together and then they’ll take it from there. Can you share a particular time or story from your time at the center here that is particularly meaningful for you? Either as a participant or as a coordinator.
You want to hear one special moment? A lot of them. Really. Because when I started at the youth center as a participant, I had many chances to be with new people and have new friends, to learn something new and to show my talents. As a coordinator, I had so many chances. I met a lot of new people. I can show my talents. I can show my ideas. And I can’t tell you one moment. Everything is special for me. I saw Pope Francis four or five times with the youth center. That’s something special. I travel a lot. I spread ideas from this center to a lot of people. I met a lot of people. That’s special. And when you have a workshop with young people, and you talk with them and explain something to them. In that moment, when you see their eyes and their happiness. There is no perfect moment, everything is perfect for me.
Thank you for sharing that, that’s beautiful. Final question, are there any aspects of the center’s programming or approach to interfaith education that can be changed or that can be improved for the future to make it better?
Everything can be improved. Yesterday, in interview, I told your colleague that it’s very important to listen to young people, what they want. And every time after, they have activity to have evaluation. It’s important to hear them, if they want to change anything. You just need to listen to them. And definitely, we can do new things to improve this program and this project, but somehow, we are going really because you have to be in tie with this world and this society. But small changes everyday for every project that we have. We can change our local things. But if young people don’t want, it’s not good. So we always listen to them, and then we’re changing them.
So young people are at the center of the change that you’re driving.
This is a youth center.
Is there anything that I didn’t ask about that you think is important to mention?
I don’t think so. I think I just told you the main things, and I hope it will help you.
