Colleagues Rev. Jackie Hibbard and Rev. Nicole Lamarche recall a moment in the wake of a mass shooting when their progressive church literally transformed unwanted firearms into garden tools, echoing the way transformation spreads from God to humanity.
This story was produced by David Dault at Sandburg Media, LLC.
Nicole Lamarche: It's weird to be a part of something that where there's a huge amount of need, but not a lot of demand. And I regularly feel that with religious life where people are lonely, they are eager to be a part of collective action, they're eager to hear something hopeful. And sometimes I feel like, over here, over here. Step right up. Here we are.
Jackie Hibbard: Yeah.
Nicole Lamarche: But especially here, where we are in this religious landscape, I do feel like a minority, often, where we are, a church where we welcome all. And what matters more to us than the idea of a holy realm beyond this is caring for one another here on this planet however we show up.
Jackie Hibbard: However we show up.
Nicole Lamarche: Sometimes people ask us about our view of the Bible, and I love pointing to that passage in Isaiah about, you know, turning swords into plowshares. And that is something we really take absolutely literally. And I wonder, Jackie, what was that like for you on that day, on that Sunday in June when I have that picture of you? It's one of my favorites, where after we cut up 34 unwanted firearms after the King Sooper massacre, and then I have that photo of you just, like, pounding, pounding. Do you remember what that's like? My sense is that's one of those things your body never forgets.
Jackie Hibbard: Yeah, I can. Yeah, that one is super visceral.
Nicole Lamarche: That picture!
Jackie Hibbard: For sure. Yeah. I mean, that whole day watching all these cars come in with unwanted firearms and then watching them be destroyed, and that one of my favorite pictures from that day is all the guns in parts in a pile.
Nicole Lamarche: In a pile. I just.
Jackie Hibbard: It's one of my favorite things still. But, yeah, when we were able to pound one of those guns and make it, I think he made it into an anvil, little garden tool, it just felt so good after the, what was it? Four months of living with uncertainty and our grocery store was destroyed and all those beautiful people's lives were destroyed, and our trust in everyday things was destroyed. And, yeah, it felt really good to pound the crap out of that thing and to squash it.
Nicole Lamarche: I was waiting to see which word you were going to use.
Jackie Hibbard: I know. I was, too. But, yeah, just pounding and pounding and pounding. It felt so good. Like, yes, this tragedy happened, and yes, it was senseless. And somebody said, nothing's ever going to change. That's kind of a dare to me. And I think for you, too, and our congregation, right? Nothing's going to change. Watch us. Because we did. And that day, pounding that piece of metal and helping him make it into that little garden tool, I'll never forget it. Never. Because that brought me hope, right? Nothing can change.
Nicole Lamarche: Mm-hmm.
Jackie Hibbard: Thirty-four guns gone. And now it's, like, all over the country.
Nicole Lamarche: The whole movement.
Jackie Hibbard: The whole movement. Like, in this time when people want all the answers, right?
Nicole Lamarche: Right now.
Jackie Hibbard: This is right, this is wrong, and they want it, yeah, 10 minutes ago, right? There's no waiting. But that's not how God's time works, right? That it's this process and it's ever-evolving. And what's happened…what’s now doesn't mean it's going to be the same in 25 years. Like, you know, even thinking over the course of my lifetime, things that have changed and evolved and our understanding of human sexuality and the use of firearms and, and, and, right? We're continually learning. And what I appreciate about our context and our understanding of the holy is that God and the holy is ever-evolving, too. And to me, that's hopeful, right?
Nicole Lamarche: But to some people that's a threat.
Jackie Hibbard: Yeah.
Nicole Lamarche: The idea that even the source itself is evolving.
Jackie Hibbard: But yeah, I think about that story of Jesus and Mary where first he calls her a dog and then by the end, you know, he's appreciating her. I mean, he evolved just in one interaction is just one example about how the holy does evolve and changes and continues to challenge us and expand us and transform us.
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